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	<title>Comments on: BTAs &amp; climate change</title>
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	<link>http://www.harryrclarke.com/2009/07/02/btas-climate-change/</link>
	<description>On economics, politics &#38; other things</description>
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		<title>By: hc</title>
		<link>http://www.harryrclarke.com/2009/07/02/btas-climate-change/comment-page-1/#comment-760</link>
		<dc:creator>hc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Jul 2009 08:20:52 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>The core material on these issues is around pages 98-110.

Tone deaf, eh? I hope your reading is correct since that improves the prospect of negotiating good outcomes in Copenhagen.

Of course I hope that such taxes are never introduced since their incredible complexity - both in terms of achieving WTO compatibility and simply of computation - invites abuse and a possible tit-for-tat collapse in world trade.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The core material on these issues is around pages 98-110.</p>
<p>Tone deaf, eh? I hope your reading is correct since that improves the prospect of negotiating good outcomes in Copenhagen.</p>
<p>Of course I hope that such taxes are never introduced since their incredible complexity &#8211; both in terms of achieving WTO compatibility and simply of computation &#8211; invites abuse and a possible tit-for-tat collapse in world trade.</p>
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		<title>By: John Quiggin</title>
		<link>http://www.harryrclarke.com/2009/07/02/btas-climate-change/comment-page-1/#comment-759</link>
		<dc:creator>John Quiggin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Jul 2009 06:59:57 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>HC, I think this is a tone-deaf reading of the report, and even of the summary you quote.  Have you read the whole thing?

Of course, there has been no change in the rules, and of course there are plenty of cautions, but I think anyone attuned to bureaucratic understatement, reading the report and planning a carefully calibrated border tax on embodied carbon would see a bright green light here. 

Peter Wood, I agree as regards W-M.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>HC, I think this is a tone-deaf reading of the report, and even of the summary you quote.  Have you read the whole thing?</p>
<p>Of course, there has been no change in the rules, and of course there are plenty of cautions, but I think anyone attuned to bureaucratic understatement, reading the report and planning a carefully calibrated border tax on embodied carbon would see a bright green light here. </p>
<p>Peter Wood, I agree as regards W-M.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter Wood</title>
		<link>http://www.harryrclarke.com/2009/07/02/btas-climate-change/comment-page-1/#comment-757</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Wood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Jul 2009 01:10:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.harryrclarke.com/?p=434#comment-757</guid>
		<description>The relevant sections of the Waxman-Markey bill are Sections 765-769 of the bill. In my opinion, BTAs should only apply if a country is not participating in, or in compliance with, an international agreement.

The provisions in W-M are different, and impose other conditions on countries. While I can see the temptation to do that, I don&#039;t think it will help. My suspicion is that the best way to have an agreement being close to socially optimal is through the right sort of bargaining process, and strong penalities for non-participation and non-compliance. Strong penalties for non-participation and non-compliance should prevent a treaty from being based on the lowest common denominator.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The relevant sections of the Waxman-Markey bill are Sections 765-769 of the bill. In my opinion, BTAs should only apply if a country is not participating in, or in compliance with, an international agreement.</p>
<p>The provisions in W-M are different, and impose other conditions on countries. While I can see the temptation to do that, I don&#8217;t think it will help. My suspicion is that the best way to have an agreement being close to socially optimal is through the right sort of bargaining process, and strong penalities for non-participation and non-compliance. Strong penalties for non-participation and non-compliance should prevent a treaty from being based on the lowest common denominator.</p>
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		<title>By: hc</title>
		<link>http://www.harryrclarke.com/2009/07/02/btas-climate-change/comment-page-1/#comment-756</link>
		<dc:creator>hc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Jul 2009 00:23:36 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>As far as I understand it actually needs a 2/3 vote to change rules but this has never happened - the WTO operates on basis of consensus weighted by economic muscle. There has been no formal rule change and hence no &#039;approval&#039;. 

The first paragraph in the Bridges quote says it all. There is no attempt to make a judgement about WTO rules compatibility. There is no claim that taxes are compatible with the rules only a list of characteristics such taxes would need to have. Necessity not sufficiency.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As far as I understand it actually needs a 2/3 vote to change rules but this has never happened &#8211; the WTO operates on basis of consensus weighted by economic muscle. There has been no formal rule change and hence no &#8216;approval&#8217;. </p>
<p>The first paragraph in the Bridges quote says it all. There is no attempt to make a judgement about WTO rules compatibility. There is no claim that taxes are compatible with the rules only a list of characteristics such taxes would need to have. Necessity not sufficiency.</p>
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		<title>By: John Quiggin</title>
		<link>http://www.harryrclarke.com/2009/07/02/btas-climate-change/comment-page-1/#comment-755</link>
		<dc:creator>John Quiggin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 21:36:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&quot;Approval would require a vote by member countries&quot;

Are you sure? I wasn&#039;t aware that there were any voting procedures associated with WTO. And a treaty at Copenhagen won&#039;t be voted on either. It will be drafted by some kind of consensus procedures and countries will choose to sign on, or not. Then the signatories can choose whether or not to tax imports from non-signatories.


As regards the situation being unchanged, there has of course been no formal change. But the WTO has given a pretty clear indication of the way in which a challenge will turn out, namely that a BTA will be approved if it is designed with careful regard to the rules.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Approval would require a vote by member countries&#8221;</p>
<p>Are you sure? I wasn&#8217;t aware that there were any voting procedures associated with WTO. And a treaty at Copenhagen won&#8217;t be voted on either. It will be drafted by some kind of consensus procedures and countries will choose to sign on, or not. Then the signatories can choose whether or not to tax imports from non-signatories.</p>
<p>As regards the situation being unchanged, there has of course been no formal change. But the WTO has given a pretty clear indication of the way in which a challenge will turn out, namely that a BTA will be approved if it is designed with careful regard to the rules.</p>
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		<title>By: hc</title>
		<link>http://www.harryrclarke.com/2009/07/02/btas-climate-change/comment-page-1/#comment-750</link>
		<dc:creator>hc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 12:35:10 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>John, Approval would require a vote by member countries. That has not occurred and today India (for example) has said it would not support such a decision.  Almost all developing countries will oppose such taxes.

It is exactly the situation as before. There remain questions about whether a discriminatory border tax is consistent with the rules of the GATT. It might be. It will almost certainly be subject to a challenge.

That was the situation a month ago.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John, Approval would require a vote by member countries. That has not occurred and today India (for example) has said it would not support such a decision.  Almost all developing countries will oppose such taxes.</p>
<p>It is exactly the situation as before. There remain questions about whether a discriminatory border tax is consistent with the rules of the GATT. It might be. It will almost certainly be subject to a challenge.</p>
<p>That was the situation a month ago.</p>
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		<title>By: John Quiggin</title>
		<link>http://www.harryrclarke.com/2009/07/02/btas-climate-change/comment-page-1/#comment-749</link>
		<dc:creator>John Quiggin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 11:46:48 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&quot;approve of’ BTAs. It does no such thing – in the main it carefully restates the conditions required for BTAs to be consistent with the rules of the GATT. &quot;

This seems like a distinction without a difference to me. The report stresses the need for global action on climate change. It then makes it clear that BTAs can be consistent with the rules of the GATT and that, provided they are designed with care, BTAs on countries that don&#039;t comply with a global agreement on emissions will pass muster with WTO. That seems like &quot;approval&quot; to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;approve of’ BTAs. It does no such thing – in the main it carefully restates the conditions required for BTAs to be consistent with the rules of the GATT. &#8221;</p>
<p>This seems like a distinction without a difference to me. The report stresses the need for global action on climate change. It then makes it clear that BTAs can be consistent with the rules of the GATT and that, provided they are designed with care, BTAs on countries that don&#8217;t comply with a global agreement on emissions will pass muster with WTO. That seems like &#8220;approval&#8221; to me.</p>
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		<title>By: Uncle Milton</title>
		<link>http://www.harryrclarke.com/2009/07/02/btas-climate-change/comment-page-1/#comment-746</link>
		<dc:creator>Uncle Milton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 03:15:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.harryrclarke.com/?p=434#comment-746</guid>
		<description>&quot;But China, India and other LDCs will be aware that the possibility of the US imposing retaliatory tariffs on there exports is there.&quot;

Which is the whole point. 

Obama sensibly hasn&#039;t threatened anything - yet - but if Chindia are obstructionist at Copenhagen then he might, more in sadness than in anger of course, have to throw the BTA bone to Congress. And while US Administrations are usually reluctant to indulge in protectionist measures, Congressmen and Senators are not.

Obama might also do Rudd a favour and implicitly threaten Australia&#039;s exports with a BTA if we don&#039;t implement an ETS. Then the acid will really be on the Opposition to pass it the CPRS.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;But China, India and other LDCs will be aware that the possibility of the US imposing retaliatory tariffs on there exports is there.&#8221;</p>
<p>Which is the whole point. </p>
<p>Obama sensibly hasn&#8217;t threatened anything &#8211; yet &#8211; but if Chindia are obstructionist at Copenhagen then he might, more in sadness than in anger of course, have to throw the BTA bone to Congress. And while US Administrations are usually reluctant to indulge in protectionist measures, Congressmen and Senators are not.</p>
<p>Obama might also do Rudd a favour and implicitly threaten Australia&#8217;s exports with a BTA if we don&#8217;t implement an ETS. Then the acid will really be on the Opposition to pass it the CPRS.</p>
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